2010-03-24: Empty Threats

[ChunLing]

The Errant war ended because there was nobody left to fight it anymore.

The elves haven't increased in numbers since then.

The Tsuiraku mages have, apparently by quite a bit.

I think that if the elves had something really good (including any idea of how to channel the powers of their gods), they might have used it when Ian was right there at their gates.

This isn't to say that the elves won't act like the Darwin award winners they are. Just that it is reasonable for the Tsuirakuans to expect otherwise.

[Rakshasa Taisab]

However, the one thing we do know about Gramps' ancestors was that they saw fit to hide from the elves and stay hidden for 1800 years. Also, it was made from a mountain in northern Veracia, a continent away from its current location. That's not "we can take them". That's "hide and run".

You are forgetting that there was a global war that only stopped because neither side had anything to fight with anymore.

[Viking-Sensei]

Face it, the tsuirakans have protoculture and the elves don't.

Ok, no Robotech metaphors.

The elves are like the big bad bosses... that you fight early on in the game. They were once a serious threat, back when humans and half-elves didn't have any civilization or order of their own. I imagine from what we know most of the half-elf "cities" they destroyed were squalid mud-hut encampments where the frightened and confused half-elf and possibly human populace had fled after their "masters" had turned on them in genocidal rage. That's nothing like attempting to assault the heavily populaced, heavily spelled, and probably heavily protected Tsuiraku.

And let's talk of locales. The elven fortress-under-a-mountain isn't the last great elven city... Tsuiraku is. Built, if I remember correctly, by the best half-elf and elf mages (when they were still getting along) and equipped with what was probably state-of-the-art technology. Granted, it went AWOL after the half-elves stole it, but a couple thousand years is nothing in elf-time - it's still brand-spanking-new to them. And not only is it new, but the not-stuck-in-the-past half-elves/humans have been improving on it ever since it came in their hands. Enhancing it, fortifying it, repairing it.

And that brings us to the last issue... the elves haven't been at war since the Errant Wars. The Tsuirakans have. They faught against (and for the most part won) the Veracians in the Mage/Priest wars. Who knows what sort of horrible wonderful weapons and defences they developed while fighting against an equally-matched-and-willing-to-progress foe.

The elves don't stand a ghost of a chance. I imagine it will be bad for Tsuiraku, but it'll be an unrecoverable Phyrric victory for the elves. I think their bluff has officially been called. Kudos, Gramps.

[Tiamat]

In RE: Viking, I thought the city was made by half-elf and human mages... now I have to go look it up. Grrrr.

[Edit]Found it: http://www.errantstory.com/2004-11-15/295
Apparently, it was all three.

[Lurker 314]

Face it, the tsuirakans have protoculture and the elves don't.

That doesn't mean the Tsuirakuans will still exist by the end of the story. Veracia wasn't a comparable foe to the elves. And remember, all of the elves, all of them, were around during the Errant War. The youngest, Misa was born during the later part of the war. They have incomparable military experience and somewhat superior magic technology.

Maybe Gramps has their number, but he's taking a big chance.

[mindstalk]

I think that if the elves had something really good (including any idea of how to channel the powers of their gods), they might have used it when Ian was right there at their gates.

Prep time matters. When you're attacked, you use what you have on time. When you attack, you can make time to build city-busting anti-magic devices.

[mindstalk]

However, the one thing we do know about Gramps' ancestors was that they saw fit to hide from the elves and stay hidden for 1800 years. Also, it was made from a mountain in northern Veracia, a continent away from its current location. That's not "we can take them". That's "hide and run".

You are forgetting that there was a global war that only stopped because neither side had anything to fight with anymore.

A war which AFA we know Tsuiraku doesn't know much about on account of their hiding before it started.

[Forrest]

However, the one thing we do know about Gramps' ancestors was that they saw fit to hide from the elves and stay hidden for 1800 years. Also, it was made from a mountain in northern Veracia, a continent away from its current location. That's not "we can take them". That's "hide and run".

You are forgetting that there was a global war that only stopped because neither side had anything to fight with anymore.

A war which AFA we know Tsuiraku doesn't know much about on account of their hiding before it started.

IIRC we don't know whether or not Tsuiraku could see out of their cloaking field when it was on. They may have been watching world history unfold below them and just considered themselves *ahem* above it all.

[mindstalk]

The elves are like the big bad bosses... that you fight early on in the game. They were once a serious threat, back when humans and half-elves didn't have any civilization or order of their own. I imagine from what we know most of the half-elf "cities" they destroyed were squalid mud-hut encampments where the frightened and confused half-elf and possibly human populace had fled after their "masters" had turned on them in genocidal rage. That's nothing like attempting to assault the heavily populaced, heavily spelled, and probably heavily protected Tsuiraku.

It's unlikely that the half-elves had squalid camps and Tsuiraku and nothing in between.
Also, the main enemy of the elves was other elves.

And that brings us to the last issue... the elves haven't been at war since the Errant Wars. The Tsuirakans have. They faught against (and for the most part won) the Veracians in the Mage/Priest wars. Who knows what sort of horrible wonderful weapons and defences they developed while fighting against an equally-matched-and-willing-to-progress foe.

I don't think the Veracians were equally matched orr willing to progress. How many warp gates or airships do they have? Yeah.

All the Tsuirakuan veterans might be dead of old age. The elves are mostly all veterans.

It seems unlikely that elf magictech has improved much in the past 2000 years... but they have better travel platforms than Tsuiraku. Tsuiraku is behind where they should have been 2000 years ago.

The elves don't stand a ghost of a chance. I imagine it will be bad for Tsuiraku, but it'll be an unrecoverable Phyrric victory for the elves. I think their bluff has officially been called. Kudos, Gramps.

Within the comic as shown, there's no basis for asserting that. It could be an equal match, or one side or the other could spank the other, all with equal plausibility.

[mindstalk]

IIRC we don't know whether or not Tsuiraku could see out of their cloaking field when it was on. They may have been watching world history unfold below them and just considered themselves *ahem* above it all.

Also true. We know very little, really.
Within the comic, we don't even know how many elves there are. Sarine's comments might lead us to think there are even fewer than what Poe has said; "half a city" could lead us to assume more.