Holy Shit!

Because it only took Viking-Sensei three years (and the approaching end of Errant Story) to come up with a better name for "General Discussions"
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Imp-Chan
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Holy Shit!

Post by Imp-Chan »

Okay, so when I was about 14 I spent a week on a Lakota reservation, essentially helping to build homes and to care for children there. They had little money, little food, and nothing with which to build or maintain houses of their own... in effect, they were completely dependent upon the U.S. (which had effectively screwed them by somewhat withdrawing support), and upon the charity of U.S. citizens. Or at least, that is how it was explained to me at the young age of 14.

Slamlander linked THIS in his livejournal earlier today, and on reading it, I was torn between a sense of FUCK YEAH, GO LAKOTA GO! WHOO! and a sense of "But what will they run this new country with? They have next to nothing already, and with no taxes how are they going to maintain their borders, especially borders that happen to be within the predatory United States? I realize that the traditional ways of the Lakota people did quite nicely without taxes or real borders for hundreds of years, but can they really imagine that they'll be left alone to live that way after this? Will the next generation even want to?"

Add to that, there are hundreds of thousands of non-Lakota living in lands that were covered by those old treaties, including some of our old forumers. Their living is not made based on Lakota lifestyles, it's made based on the American lifestyle, and the combined weight of those businesses will have a large impact on the U.S. economy if they are to suddenly fold due to relocation. Not to mention things like power plants and water treatment facilities and other public works! Are these people to be displaced just like that? If they surrender their citizenship in order to keep their homes, what happens to them? What laws will govern them or protect them, as non-Lakota? How WILL they be able to maintain their lifestyle?

And THEN, consider that the Lakota are not the only native people to have been shafted in treaties with the U.S. government. IF this works for the Lakota, what stops the other native people from doing the same? This country was once entirely "owned" by native peoples... what happens to the MILLIONS of people who have moved here since, should the other screwed natives decide to reset the clock and reclaim what was once legally theirs? How far back are we willing to go, when in addition to its lofty principles this nation was founded on warfare and GENOCIDE!, so there are a lot of people we could be said to "owe?"

So... what does everyone else think about this?

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Stick & String
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Re: Holy Shit!

Post by Stick & String »

I have been advised to take this story with a grain of salt. It is a rehash of a political statement from a few decades ago. A couple of my friends in South Dakota dont put any likelyhodd into it (and 2 of them are Lakota Souix).
Its more of a watch and see thing. I first saw this stroy in AFP. They just love to invent stories (stage, twist, etc) to make the US look bad, to suit their anti-american fixation. That in itself made me call my freinds to ask them what the hell is going on.
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Slamlander
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Re: Holy Shit!

Post by Slamlander »

Well, because the main media rags aren't taking it up, I'm kicking back and watching it too. I am very sympathetic to Native American issues but I also remember the Wounded Knee fiasco really well. It is definitely interesting and, if granted legal traction, could seriously impact the US. As I said in that post, this has the potential to change things. Let's see if that potential becomes realised.

Impy: Practical considerations, that you listed, are not relevant to the law, as cited. Also, look through the reference links I also gave. Notably, the Mantle of Shame. Not all of the Lakota back this move.
Bekul
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Re: Holy Shit!

Post by Bekul »

Eh. Two-hundred years ago my ancestors were slaughtered out by the British, forced to relocate, had their land seized, many starved to death, were treated like animals.

If this were to work for me, with as large as my family is now, my family would own all of Ireland.
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Vavrek
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Re: Holy Shit!

Post by Vavrek »

According to the discussions I've been in on another forum, the primary man involved in the declaration has no real tribal authority. He's a crank, and the tribe leaders haven't reaffirmed anything he's said. They haven't bothered to explicitly deny him, but... It could simply be that they don't give a damn and they know full well how much of a crank he is.

For the best, I suppose, but kind of a pity. Could've had a war on our own soil again.
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